Avalon 2011

Does anyone know what international aircraft will be attending Avalon next year. I've heard the usual rumours including that of a B-2.

Does anyone know what Australian aircraft will be attending Avalon next year.

No F-111s doing the dump and burn

No Caribou doing the wheelbarrow

No B707 doing simulated air to air refueling

and no Boeing factory Super Hornet doing full weapons load aerobatics

...could be a bit tame!!!


Maybe South Korea could send some Phantoms to rattle the North.

Okay. I've now heard more rumours of a B-2 and F-22 raptor. Any truth to these?

I think that the rumour about the PLAAF J-20 is far fetched!

:P

BC

Dean, these two types were requested from US, but I don't know if they have confirmed.

I would be very disappointed ifthe F-22 didn't show. I am in the process of organising to go to Avalon for the first time.

F-22's have appeared twice in the UK, once in 2008 and again in 2010. On both occasions, security was very tight, and the aircraft didn't land anywhere except the US operated bases of RAF Fairford and RAF Lakenheath.

On the first occasion in 2008, 3 Langley machines arrived and operated from RAF Fairford They were due to appear at RIAT but the show was cancelled because of flooding. One did do a flypast at the SBAC Farnborough show, but didnt' land there. They were housed in the B2 hangars the entire time they were at Fairford. The B2 hangars were built at Fairford by the USAF to support deployments of B2's.

On the second occasion in 2010, 4 Elmendorf machines arrived at RAF Lakenheath. Two of these re-located to RAF Fairford for the 2010 RIAT and SBAC Farnborough shows. Again, no aircraft was in the static, only flying. And when on the ground they were kept either in Hardened shelters (RAF Lakenheath) or the B2 hangars at Fairford.

Now slap me down with a wet digiree-doo, but, I don't think I've read of an F-22 ever landing at a non USAF operated base outside of the continental USA. The nearest F-22's to Oz are those at Hickham AFB in Hawaii, which is too far for a round-robin (non-landing) airshow appearance at Avalon IMHO.

So given previous history with F-22, I can't see it being that likely that it'll appear on the ground at Avalon. Perhaps in the air if the USAF can be persuaded that it can be operated securely from a closeby ADF base - but where? Woomera?

B-2 is a different story, and were regular visitors at RIAT, Farnborough and Mildenhall airshows in the 1990's and early 2000's. Most of the time these were round-robin non stop flights from their home base in Missouri, and the aircraft didn't land. If they did land it was only for an hour or so to change crews. I can only remember one occasion when a B2 nightstopped, and that was one of the RIAT's at Fairford, and the aircraft was hangared overnight. And when in the air, the B-2 was always escorted by two UK based USAF F-15's, presumably to disguise it's radar and heat signiture from 'prying' radars.

So again, IMHO a B-2 on the ground is unlikely, although a non-landing flyby is a possibility.

The other point is that the USAF specialy train up one or two pilots on each aircraft type to perform at airshows. Last year there was only one F-22 qualified display pilot. The USAF website lists the airshows where each display team will be performing, http://www.acc.af.mil/aerialevents/index.asp. What this means is that if Avalon isn't on the USAF list for the F-22 display team, then there won't be an F-22 aerial display there.

My bet's for Avalon? A USAF KC-135, C-17 and a Herk. Perhaps if you're lucky a B-1. And as a pointer to the future, perhaps a Glbal Hawk, Reaper or Predator. Sorry to say, not much chance of the RAF/RN sending anything.

Cheers,
Malcolm


Cheers,
Malcolm

This post has been edited by Judwin on Jan 21 2011, 08:26 PM

Malcolm

F-22s deployed to Japan or Okinawa in 2008 or 09 - remember the problem with computers crossing the dateline for the first time, and returning to Hickham? And you may be right, it was possibly a US-operated base in Japan.

A USAF KC-135, C-17 and a Herc may be what arrives - but we did ask for an F-22 and B-2 !! There again, with no export potential, there is no great driver to go to the trouble of sending them, is there?

Thanks - but you have overlooked the fact that F-22's appeared at Dubai and more recently in Santiago, Chile (FIDAE 10) also B-2's have overnighted in Darwin.

Hell if the Chileans can get them we must be in with a chance - they probably desensitise the F-22's for airshows but we don't care about that too much :lol:

Im not saying you won't get an F-22 and/or B-2 at Avalon, but from this side of the world it seems unlikely. As far as I can tell...

[Dubai] 6 aircraft were deployed to an unspecified military airfield in the UAE for an exercise, together with a similar number of Rafales and Typhoons. The F-22 only appeared at the show on two days of the week long event. It didn't land at the show or appear in the static as far as I can tell.

[Chile] I don't know what happened there, but I can't find any photos on the net of the aircraft in static?

[Japan] Deployments here are more regular, but AFAIK they always go to Kadena AFB on Okinawa, which is a USAF operated base. IIRC there have also been F-22 deployments to Guam and Diego Garcia, again both are USAF controlled.

[B2's] Have also nightstopped in the UK (at Fairford) when on excercise and on round the world Global Power missions. What they don't tend to do is nightstop at airshows. They fly 5000 miles from Missouri to the UK, do one or two flybys, and then fly 5000 miles back to Missouri again. If it's a two day show, they either appear on one day only, or they do it all over again on the second day, often using the same aircraft both days. I'll bet the ones at DRW didn't park up next to the civil terminal amongst the Qantas, Jetstars and Virgin Blues :-)

Again, I hope I'm wrong and you get both, but I wouldn't be spending lots of time and money to get to Avalon on the basis of a few roadside posters alone.

Two F-22 are coming to Avalon. One static and one performing a handling display. These are F-22 from on deployment to Guam. Also been confirmed that a B-2 will do flyover ex Guam.

This post has been edited by Mick.B on Jan 27 2011, 06:00 PM

Great news Mick. There are also reports around of F-22s making their debut at Aero India next month, so it seems they will be getting around. The issue of operating off foreign soil shouldn't be too much of a problem and i have definitely seen video from Chile last year of them operating from the show site

As for the B-2, that also makes sense ex Guam. It was mentioned that B-2s have overnighted at Darwin before? I know they have landed there, but from memory they were always for 'engines running' crew changes only

Airliners.net has photos of at least 3 F22s from 1 Tactical Fighter Wing which deployed to Seville, Spain on 16 January 2011.

One of the B2s which landed in Darwin and did the crew change was the one that crashed on Guam (?) some weeks/months (?) later.

Seville, Spain is actually Moron AFB which has a major USAF installation at it. Most of the USAF assets that cross the Atlantic en-route the middle east (Iraq/Afganistan) stage thorugh Moron. Before Gulf War 1 & 2 Moron was the base that the F-117's staged through en-route Saudi Arabia, usually in the middle of the night.

A B2 flyby sounds entirely possible, but UK experiance is that it often only occurrs on one day of a multi day show. Therefore, in the UK spotters will normally wait untill the flying schedules are leaked before deciding which day to attend.

If only 2 F-22's deploy to Oz then either they'll both be static, or one will be a flyer and the other a spare. I don't know the layout at Avalon, but IF they are landing there, and IF one is flying then unless the military flightlines are close to the crowd lines then the other one won't be in static. Also, the USAF will want them guarded at all times, and hangared overnight.

As I said earlier, the USAF only had one qualified F-22 display pilot last year. The schedules for this year aren't posted yet, but if this year is the same then it'll be a pilot from 1st FW, Langley Virginia. However, it's entirely possible that he'll be flown in from the USA on a civilian airliner or military transport to fly jets from other fighter wings.

Another point - given how far they have to come for Avalon, the F-22's could possibly be part of a larger detachment deployed to Oz for an excercise. If I were an Oz-Mil-Spotter, I'd be keeping a close eye on the rumor-boards for Williamtown, Amberley, Darwin and Tindal for the two weeks either side of the show. :ph34r:

Keep an eye on Williamtown folks.

An update from the organisers on the F-22......

http://www.airshow.net.au/avalon2011/PDFs/...ian-1st-F22.pdf

Cheers

Michael

F-22 for Avalon
Item by australianaviation.com.au February 5 2011

http://australianaviation.com.au/2011/02/f-22-for-avalon/

"Among the attractions to be seen at next month’s Australian International Airshow at Avalon will be the US Air Force’s stealthy F-22 Raptor air superiority fighter.

“This is a special aircraft and we have been trying to get it to Avalon for many years,” Airshow CEO Ian Honnery said. “It is really exciting that at long last we will be able to host the F-22 for the Australian public to see for the first time.”

The F-22 on display at Avalon is expected to come from the Elmendorf, Alaska based F-22s currently deployed to Kadena, Japan.

“Avalon 2011 will be the largest show we have put on to date, with so many aircraft being exhibited, that we have had to extend our aircraft static display parks to fit them all in,” Honnery said.

The Avalon Airshow runs from March 1-6, with gates open to the public from 2.00pm on Friday March 4."

Hmmm. Two weeks to go, and two bits of news for you.

1) Dispite rumors that it would, the F-22 didn't turn up in India for the Bangalore trade/airshow. Lockheen Martin/ACC have confirmed that it won't attend.

2) The Schedule for the F-22's display pilot - Major David "Zeke" Skalicky of the 1st FW Langley Va - has been published on ACC's website here:

http://www.acc.af.mil/aerialevents/f22a/index.asp
or
http://www.acc.af.mil/aerialevents/demoteamschedule.asp

The first public F22 "role demo" (i.e. fully aerobatic display) is advertised as being on March 19-20 at Luke AFB, AZ. What this means, IMHO, is that if Zeke isn't in Oz in early March, then Avalon won't be getting an F-22 (aerobatic) flying display. A flyby or two is possible if there are F-22's in country on exercise. I still think a static example is unlikely.

The Lockheed Martin website says this about Avalon.

"Avalon Air Show
Lockheed Martin will participate in the Avalon Air Show March 1-6 in Geelong, Australia. The Avalon Air Show will highlight the year’s commercial and military milestones. At the exposition, MS2 will feature the MH-60R and EQ-36 radar"

No mention of F-22 there? :ph34r:

Hope I'm wrong, but....

However, On the plus side...

http://www.stripes.com/news/pacific/okinaw...sEnabled=false#

Seems to indicate that the the USAF will/have deployed Alaska F-22's and Aggressor F-16's to Kadena, Japan for 3/4 months starting in Feb. So the AustralianAviaton.com.au sounds possible.

Raptors arrived last night in style. 200ft flyby with a sharp left pull up over the stands.
Both Raptors remain out in the open on static display next to a B1. You get a great look as you are only about 5 metres away from them. Get to get a good look at the ass end also. Pilots are too happy to have a chat.

This post has been edited by Mick.B on Mar 3 2011, 05:17 AM

Brochure: http://www.lockheedmartin.com/avalon/magaz...670-avalon.html

Has an excellent demo video of C130J Display at Farnborough.

Guys,

did anyone get any images of the F-22's as they came in for Avalon? Its funny we havnt seen anything posted here. I have some static shots but flying/taxing would be nicer...

Thanks
Darren

Probably no images as they were probably still in stealth mode during landing. LOL

I was there for the arrival and departure. The shots I got were ok it was getting quite dark when they arrived. I will post them asap.