Gannet Tailcode

One question that I have on the Gannet page regards the tailcode B
It was certainly used on RAN Gannets at RNAS Culdrose.
I have found no evidence that this was actually used once the Gannets embarked on HMAS Melbourne

Any clarification would be welcome

Not sure if it's relavent to RAN machines, but the UK/RN tailcodes referred to the carrier or base the aircraft was assigned to. Off the top of my head

B = HMS Bulwark
E = HMS Eagle
H = HMS Hermes

And in later years
L = HMS Illustrious
N = HMS Invincible
R = HMS Ark Royal

Cheers
Malcolm

Initially HMAS Melbourne Code was 'Y' then 'M' so Gannets would have had these tail codes at those times. NAS Nowra was 'NW'. I'm guessing the 'B' Gannet tail code was used before embarking for Australia from UK as indicated above.

This post has been edited by Luig on Jul 26 2013, 07:20 PM

Attached Image

Yes,I think it was to do with the a/c being attached to RNAS Culdrose. Could be wrong but I'll make some inquiries and see what can be dug up. This is where we miss "Windy"

UK shore establisments off the top of my head :

CU = RNAS Culdrose
VL = RNAS Yeovilton
LM = RNAS Lossiemouth
PO = RNAS Portland

There are(were) orthers - Lee on solent, Ford, Brawdy. However, these are all shore establisments, and only the training squadrons would normally carry these tailcodes. RN training squadrons were always (well nearly always) in the 7xx range.

If the "B" in these pictures is related to UK/RN usage, then it implies these aircraft were embarked in HMS Bulwark.

Judwin, you are probably right. I have/had the information about this somewhere here on my computer or on a disc or somewhere about, but do you think I can find it :angry: :(

Thanks for the replies
What is not clearly visible in the above scan is the "RAN" above the serial
These are our Gannets before they left for Australai aboard HMAS Melbourne
I wonder if there was any connection to HMS Bulwark in the working up period

Perhaps MELBOURNE did have 'B' as the deck letter/tail code for that one year as indicated in the .GIF graphic above. There may have been no connection to Culdrose? It seems it was easy to change these letters - and they were changed.

This post has been edited by Luig on Jul 27 2013, 08:14 PM

Hi Guys,

I always thought that the the letter "B" was the first deck code assigned to HMAS Melbourne based aircraft and was not a shore establishment code as they are usually a two letter assignment.

Dave, I agree, Windy would have known the answer to this in a flash.

Perhaps it was changed from B because it conflicted with HMS Bulwark.

Would love to see some documentary evidence.

Fascinating stuff!

Cheers

BC

Yes I was just looking at the Gannet page and it all comes back to me now. When I worked with Windy at the Museum at Nowra, I asked him the same question re the B on the tail. It was an early code letter for HMAS Melbourne, the code then went to Y and then M. We had entered these details on the bottom of the Gannet page.

I wrote an article on the Gannet, published Sep 1995.
I conferred with Windy, and he had told me the following:

B - RNAS Culdrose (1955), yes surprising not a 2-letter code
Y - HMAS Melbourne (1955-58)
M - HMAS Melbourne (1958-67)

The original "B' codes assigned to 816 and 817 Sqns were:
816 Sqn
421/B XA332
422/B XA331
423/B XA330
424/B XA329
425/B XA328
426/B XA327

817 Sqn
431/B XA333
432/B XA326
433/B WN456
434/B WN459
435/B WN458
436/B WN457

Confusion reigns :o

The attached email from Windy some years ago should clear the matter up.



Dave,
XA436( 306/Y) was allotted to 816 squadron and embarked in HMAS MELBOURNE when the Senior Pilot of 816 Squadron ditched it on 17 December 1956. . Unfortunately all 816 squadron records were lost in the fire in December 1976 so the only name I have is that of the pilot
LCDR(P) A. Payne, RAN.
Incidentially side numbers up til laround the arrival of the Trackers and Skyhawks belonged to the squadron and an aircraft like the Gannet could have a series of side numbers , used for eay recognition as they were very large , much larger than the serial numbers. As for the Air Group when Gannets were first acquired the side number was a three figure group starting with 4 , and followed by the ships deck letter in this case "B" e.g. "403/B". Later when
the ships letter changed to "Y" the letter code had aslo changed
e.g "304/Y", later the ships deck letter became "M " and by now the
800 group was used e.g "803/M" . ashore groups of 800 numbers were alloted to the training squadrons and the tail letter was "NW"...
For instance XA326 had a number of side numbers through out her life. 423/B, 311/y. 825/M , 853/M, 880/NW . from the side number one can determine which squadron owned the aircraft Hope that will help
Windy

Thanks Dave. Good ole Windy. RIP.

Thanks very much for sorting that out Dave.
I do recall this matter being raised a few years ago and it is good to have a definitive answer.
I think a brief summary should be included on the Gannet page (and I assume the Sea Venoms used a similar convention)
If I am correct in my observations later aircraft ie Wessex, Trackers (except for a few Es that recieved new numbers after the Gs arrived) and Skyhawks kept their side numbers throughout their service life.

No worries Martin. Yes the Wessex changed their side numbers...WA-200 was initially coded as 80 and so it went up the line. The codes changed in the early 60's to the current buzz numbers that they have/had. So WA-200 became N7-200 and coded as 10 on the fuselage and 810 on the bottom of the nose fairing.

Yes after the A4Gs and S-2Es arrived the aircraft side numbers (we did not use the term 'buzz number' - in my days up till mid 1970s - I believe that is an American term for 'side number') remained the same. Both aircraft were instantly interchangeable between front line and training squadrons (except for the TA4G which could not go to sea).

Thanks Folks,

Dave produced another document offline from Windy which also adds some further Side Number/Tail Code combinations and the following footnote:

I've added that to the Gannet Page along with a the new tie ups and a link to this discussion.

Cheers

BC